Kitchen Garden Living with Bailey Van Tassel - Ep. 239

[00:00:00] Back at the beginning of the year, I asked you to think about why you garden. Whether it's a hobby, our family's main food source, or anything in between, I maintain that understanding why you garden is really important to planning the garden and defining a budget. But what about the garden being more than just a source of food, exercise, or a connection to nature? What if it were something more?

[00:00:23] That is the question that Bailey Van Tassel has asked and answered. Bailey is the founder of the Kitchen Garden Society and author of the recently released book, Kitchen Garden Living. She has taken an approach to gardening that is not just seasonal in nature, but all-encompassing in its seasonality, growing not just food, but friendships, gifts, and time with family.

[00:00:47] Like many of us, Bailey feels like our society has become disconnected from what we really need versus what we've been programmed to want. And that having a sense of getting just enough from our garden can take us back to being really connected, not just to our own body's cues for what we need, but also to our food and the true flavor of it.

[00:01:09] Today on Just Grow Something, I sit down with Bailey and chat all things kitchen garden, flavor gaps, winter bulk, and moving a garden from one climate to another. We also get into her book and her unique way of determining exactly what gets prioritized in her garden beds using playing cards and the game of poker. Let's dig in.

[00:01:33] Hey, I'm Karen, and what started as a small backyard garden 20 years ago turned into a lifelong passion for growing food. Now, as a market farmer and horticulturist, I want to help you do the same. On this podcast, I am your friend in the garden, teaching evidence-based techniques to help you grow your favorites and build confidence in your own garden space. So grab your garden journal and a cup of coffee and get ready to just grow something.

[00:01:57] So Bailey Van Tassel shares her gardening skills online through her blog, her Kitchen Garden Society monthly membership, and now her new Substack newsletter, while also sharing her personal story of growing up on a hobby farm in California, but then ending up in suburbia. Bailey focuses on kitchen gardening and cut flowers with her three young children alongside her,

[00:02:25] and she and I are in total agreement about the reasons why we should all be eating seasonally. Why do you think eating seasonally is so important? That is a great question. For one, it's the most nutritious way to actually eat because eating vegetables, when they're not in peak season, they reduce in nutritional density as each, you know, as that peak window closes, the amount of nutrients available to your body does as well.

[00:02:53] So eating seasonally by design from like a biological science perspective is the healthiest way for you to consume food. Aside from that, I also feel like it is part of our humanity to not expect everything to be available all the time and also not force things to travel to us. So what nature is going to provide for you nutritionally and seasonally is what's going to be best for your body,

[00:03:23] where you live and where you are in your life. And I really feel like getting back to that sort of connectedness is so important for our sanity and just the state of being as humans. And that is something that the garden really taught me was, you're not supposed to be able to have a tomato in December. That's not the job of a tomato. I find that that changes also based on where you live. If you live in, you know, sunny California and or in Florida,

[00:03:53] where citrus is available in the wintertime, because that's the climate that you live in, versus somebody like me who is in West Central Missouri, where none of that is available. But in the wintertime, our sustenance is things that can easily be stored, you know, potatoes, winter squashes, onions, and they pair with the meats and stuff that are sort of comfort foods, which is something that you would eat in the wintertime, but not necessarily something that your body craves in the summertime,

[00:04:21] when things like fresh greens and tomatoes and all those vibrant flavors are available to you. And, you know, I mean, you just moved, you moved from California to Tennessee here recently. How has that changed been? It's been wild. It's the first time I've experienced living somewhere that gets a hard frost and we have the greenhouse, but it's a new way of thinking about things.

[00:04:47] I mean, gardening in a Southern climate zone 10B, it's really a marathon instead of a sprint. You don't have to be super vigilant about when you start things. It's very easy to mess up as a gardener in Southern California. You just kind of like restart here. It's more of a sprint where I'm really going to have to be active in March and April to make sure I get a great crop. I'm really going to have to be figuring out fall gardening, which typically is my favorite.

[00:05:15] But here it's really going to be playing between, oh, is it still too hot and humid for these things? I know that they'll germinate, but will they mature appropriately? So there's going to be a lot more nuance to uncover and then allowing sort of wintering to happen, which I'm not used to, but I've been enjoying so far. So it'll be a change for sure. But there is something to be said for also, which is so counterculture. But like, you know, you bulk up and you put on a little layer to keep you warm in the winter.

[00:05:44] You're sleeping more in the winter. But in the spring and summer, that's going to change. You're more active. You're out. You're longer days. You're doing those things. So I think like humanity needs to just allow the seasons to like let us be a little bit, which I love. But yeah, it will be it will be crazy to see what a real gardening season this first year. I'm going to have to ask everybody to give me some grace on potentially just absolutely failing, which will be really fun to do publicly.

[00:06:12] Bailey is a big proponent of living seasonally, not just eating with the seasons. Something that may change a little bit now that she's moved from a warmer climate to one that actually has more variations to the seasons. Do you think making that change from California to Tennessee now is also going to change, you know, sort of your concept of living seasonally and kitchen garden sort of living because the seasons are so drastically different? Yes, for sure.

[00:06:40] I can already tell that one, we really have to change our mindset around like what we're capable of in the winter. And that whole philosophy, I just keep telling myself, like there's no such thing as bad weather. There's just bad clothing and really pushing everyone to get outside even when it's cold because there are blue skies, but it's, you know, 15 degrees, which it typically is not this cold in Tennessee, we're being told. But really pushing ourselves to continue to enjoy nature and the seasons in just a different format.

[00:07:10] But likewise, in the summer, I just imagine so much more outside time. In California, it's always nice and it's just so easy to take advantage of it. But here it's like, I can just really see how we're like going to be truly living outside in spring and fall, especially, but even in the summer, just like really, really packing it in.

[00:07:35] I just, I can already see our bodies like reorienting in that way where we're really like, you just hype it up in your mind where you're like, I can't wait for these, like being able to take long walks. You know, now it's like, oh gosh, if we can make it 20 minutes, like then we're stoked and you're kind of figuring out how do we do inside better. But I can just really see how everybody is going to maximize their outside time. Cause you kind of get fatigued by that when it's like 70 degrees all the time.

[00:08:01] I don't think that's natural and it's boring to be totally honest, but you just, you don't take advantage of that great weather when you're in it all the time. And, and therefore I think end up inside oddly more than you would. So there's a bit of a shift for sure. When you are, you know, changing up different climates.

[00:08:21] I remember as a gardener in the, out here in the Midwest, it, it was like this aha moment that I had when I was growing rosemary. And here, you know, rosemary is most times not a perennial. You have to replant it like every single season. It doesn't get huge unless you put it in a pot and then you bring it in the house over the winter time.

[00:08:47] And for some reason, one day I remembered that my ex-in-laws in California had a rosemary bush in their front entryway. They didn't use it culinarily. It wasn't an herb to them. It was just this bush. It was ornamental there for a part of the landscaping. And I, and I just kind of went, oh my gosh. Oh my gosh.

[00:09:11] What a huge difference between that and what I'm struggling to do here, you know, in, in the, in the Midwest. And I just think it, you know, it's a, it's a really interesting sort of, you know, juxtaposition. You get, you get the chance to experience that now having going from, you know, one climate. So 10B to what's your, what's your growing zone now? 7B. Yeah. It will be interesting for sure. Yeah. We had giant rosemary bushes at our last house and citrus teas and avocados and everything pretty

[00:09:39] much could grow as a perennial if you want it to. When I tell you my gardening friends to check and see whether something is a perennial in your area before deciding to plant something. This is exactly what I mean. Rosemary is often listed as a perennial on tags in the garden center, but it is most decidedly not one in my zone 6B garden, although it was in Bailey's zone 10B one. We'll see how it does for her now that she's in 7B.

[00:10:09] As you can tell, Bailey believes that living seasonally and staying grounded to the natural world is really important to creating a meaningful life, no matter where you are so much so that she's written a book about it. You just released a book and it's called Kitchen Garden Living. I'm going to pull that up for everybody so they can, they can see this.

[00:10:34] The first thing that I did when I got this was I had to flip through and look at all the pictures because they were just so amazing. And your garden was beautiful. The next thing I did was have a little bit of a panic attack seeing like you wearing a white shirt. But the next thing that I found, I found it very interesting. The way that you broke down the chapters, I think was very compelling. It was a very interesting breakdown.

[00:11:03] It basically laid out in terms of how the garden is used, you know? So, I mean, yeah, you start with the seasons, but then it's plan, grow, tend, make, gather, connect, and inspire. I found that to be really interesting and kind of inspiring. And I think that really goes along with what your message has been, which is the garden is more about you're actually living in it. Like this is, it's more than just food, right? Right.

[00:11:31] Um, yeah, that was really, you know, it's funny. I guess I haven't actually read that many gardening books. There was one that was like really, really key to establishing fundamentals and how I grow the way that I do in terms of sort of a French intensive style, like really dense planting, um, a lot of biodiversity, companion planting, all that. I read a book that really like inspired that for me, but yeah, I didn't realize how different

[00:12:00] the layout and message of my book was compared to other gardening books. My point in all of it is like the kitchen garden can help you reorient yourself to the rhythms of nature and enhance your life in that way, because it is providing you with, um, this moving meditation and this ultra nutritious food and this really cool way to reconnect with yourself and with nature and overall just enhance your life. That's kind of always been the message and trying to really get back to that and maintain

[00:12:30] that sense of inspiring people. Um, I obviously want to equip everyone. There's a ton of practical knowledge in the book, but I did really want everyone to think about it on that cycle of like, okay, we like, we get the garden going, we plan it out. We've got everything we need to know to make the garden happy and beautiful, but then what, you know, then what it's like, okay, well then. You know, this is how we properly harvest and preserve things and share it with the world and like, just kind of lean into it more.

[00:12:59] It's similar to like someone coming to you with a problem and you give them a solution, but you don't give them the support to like overcome the actual problem. And I think that is something I really want to where it's like, okay, I'm going to teach you how to garden, but I'm also going to teach you how to like fall in love with gardening for the rest of your life. So it's not just a fat pad. I love that. I love that. I love that. That whole message.

[00:13:26] And I think, you know, in terms of practical application, the other thing that I thought was, was really interesting is your, your poker card method for planting. Talk to me about aces, faces, planes, and jokers. Yes. I'm so glad everyone's been excited about this because it's sort of my own little proprietary method. I immediately, when I started gardening was like, I want to try and grow as much of what we consume as possible.

[00:13:55] So like grow the grocery store, replace the grocery store, whatever. And that felt really overwhelming to me because I just couldn't figure out like how to make that happen. And so what I did is the poker planting method is just, it just helps you prioritize the plants in your garden to give you a very easy way to say like, okay, these plants go in first because they're going to, I want them to have the most space. They're most important to me. And then these plants go in next because they're of a little bit less importance to me, or I

[00:14:25] can get them at a farm. These even less so because they're more just for fun. It was just a way for me to organize the plants in my mind and get them into my garden. So I could actually maximize the space that I have. I know this struggle of figuring out what to plant and where to fit it all in is very familiar to a lot of us. It's one of the things that we spend a lot of time on in my plan, like a pro course, because it can be very overwhelming.

[00:14:53] I generally teach gardeners to fit it all in using companion planting combined with interplanting by going high, low, fast, slow. Okay. This is pairing the tall plants with the low growing ones and then the fast maturing varieties with the slow growing ones. What Bailey is doing is combining the plants in such a way that the high priority plants, the one she really needs in the garden, get the spotlight and most of the space and then

[00:15:23] tucking in the other plants in order of priority from there on down. It's a unique way to organize the beds in terms of making sure that you don't run out of space for the things that are most important to you. Essentially, each plant is assigned like an ROI or like a value in your mind. So ACEs are the most valuable for me. That's like potatoes, onions, garlic, those really like, I am cooking with these on a daily basis.

[00:15:52] I know if I give them the time and space in the garden, I can completely replace them for my family. I know that they grow well. I know that we use them. I know that we love them. Something like radicchio, like we don't eat that that much. It's like really cool to grow because I think it's really pretty, but my kids don't really like the taste of it. We're just not eating it that often. So that's deprioritized. If I have space, I'll sneak in some radicchio, but it's not actually going to like enhance

[00:16:20] the quality of our lives, you know, like onions, well things, because I really do find every single spring people are completely perplexed by seed starting and by just mapping out the garden. Like just where do all the things go and how do I like stay on top of it? And sometimes the problem is you're trying to fit too much. You don't have to grow 12 different varieties of tomatoes if that's not your main thing. You know, yeah, they look cool, but how is that serving you?

[00:16:47] This is a problem for beginning and experienced gardeners alike. There is often a temptation to grow as many things as possible because they look cool or we think it's expected or it's the trend or we're trying to literally replace all the things from the grocery store. By prioritizing what we plant by how we'll use it, we can save ourselves a lot of stress in not just the planning phase, but in all the phases of gardening.

[00:17:15] There's an idea that Bailey stumbled upon in her own garden of just enoughness. Oh, in chapter five, the make chapter. I want to read just a little portion of that. I loved the idea of just enoughness. In the kitchen garden are parallels. A handful of cherry tomatoes on a summer's day is all we need. Not a big plastic clamshell full of gas ripened fruit.

[00:17:43] Wandering out into the garden to find a rogue potato plant that yields two perfect spuds for the following morning's breakfast burritos makes us happy. There is a just enoughness in the garden, which you'll find quickly leaks into the rest of your home and the lives of you and your family. How can you make what you already have enough? And if you do need more, can you make it yourself?

[00:18:10] And this is what I'm talking about with this book and just sort of your whole, you know, idea and the way that you do things in this community that you've grown. It's not just about, okay, well here I grew this and then here's a recipe for how to use it. And then I'm, I'm done. There are so much more, you know, that you can do with the garden and what comes out of it and how it sort of flows into the rest of your life. I love that you picked that up.

[00:18:36] It's just something, I think the garden is an endless well of, you know, inspiration and life analogies. I like to let the garden dictate what we cook and going out there and seeing what's available and bringing it inside and like letting that be where I come from for, instead of being like, oh, I'm in the mood for enchiladas. And then like, you know, it's more like, what do we have and how, how can we do something good with it? And tomatoes, I don't really love to grow. I think they're divas. I think they're high maintenance.

[00:19:06] I think they're overhyped. And so I never grow like that many of them, but every time I do, it's like truly my handful of cherry tomatoes, like is enough to saute with a little bit of garlic and olive oil to coat our pasta. And it's, there's just so much overconsumption or sort of just like allowing other people to decide quantity for us because of how we shop in the grocery store that you're not even realizing what you need to like make the meal happen.

[00:19:34] So I kept seeing that in my garden where I was always yearning for like more garden, more veggies, growing more. It was kind of like a weird ego thing where I was just like, I just wanted this big garden, but I always had enough to make an amazing meal and let what I was growing be the star of the show. And so it was really this cool experience for me to be like, whatever the amount of space

[00:19:59] is, if you allow it to be good enough for you right now, you'll find a way to maximize it. And I do think that leaks over and it just gives you that deep sense of satisfaction. And I tell people this all the time, whether you have a one acre garden or one pot full of just culinary herbs, we are all going to experience the same joy of like harvesting something that we grew, adding it to our food and making that taste amazing. And there's just this sense of like, I did this.

[00:20:28] It doesn't matter how much you have or how big it's like that. It's just that fundamental tiny little moment where you're like, I did this. And then you get to share it with someone and they love it. And it's just that really, that's joy. In my opinion, I just really wanted people to feel like it was accessible, that joy, that satisfaction. It's not about growing a hundred tomato plants. It's growing just enough tomatoes to be able to experience the joy of that homegrown flavor.

[00:20:55] I have said before, it is a very visceral feeling when you can look down on your plate and see just one thing that you grew yourself. It's like something primal deep inside that you provided for yourself. You're providing for others. And it was sort of like what we were meant to do. And buying all of your stuff in the grocery store doesn't give you that opportunity anymore.

[00:21:21] Science has shown us that doing things with our hands, manual tasks like gardening and cooking releases serotonin and endorphins, all those feel good hormones. And it reduces cortisol, the stress hormone. Doing manual tasks like gardening don't only give us a sense of pride in our accomplishment or satisfaction in providing for others, but they have been clinically shown to improve

[00:21:50] our mood, our attention span, and even our memory. I think we're like disconnected from what we need to a certain degree too. You know, we're planning everything for like efficiency instead of waking up and being like, you know, I'm really craving papaya today. And I think our body gives us a ton of cues. And there's a lot of stuff going on with everyone's body that if we were just like listening a little bit more closely to what our body's craving and wanting and needing, we can unpack a lot of that.

[00:22:20] But we're so distracted and we're so numb by like everything else that we're just like meet the fundamental need as quickly and efficiently as possible and make it feel good. So, you know, I am not perfect at this by any means, but it's just something I'm always thinking about. Yeah. Yeah. I think the fact that, that we live in such a global economy now and as the, you know,

[00:22:43] especially in the U S we rely a lot on sort of those outside, you know, sources for a lot of how we live that it's gotten a lot more difficult for us to be able to understand the signals that we're getting from our own bodies that say, you know, Hey, we're, we need something sweet or we need, you know, and it's like, Oh, well, I'm just going to grab, you know, this piece of candy or this chocolate or this, whatever, instead of, Hey, maybe some fresh fruit.

[00:23:12] That's nice and sweet. That might be the carbs that your body is looking for. Not necessarily that cream filled donut that's sitting over there on your counter. You know, it's made it a little bit confusing, I think for people and doing something like having a kitchen garden and being out there and in it physically in it, I think, you know, probably would put people, you know, further or closer to understanding a little bit more about what their body is asking of them. Well, it's really interesting.

[00:23:42] I read this study, um, out of the UK, like out of London, and they were talking about how doctors were prescribing people with 20 minutes of gardening a day as an sort of antidote to anxiety and depression. And the reason that gardening makes us feel better or reduces the feelings of depression and anxiety is because it increases the amount of perceived happiness that we have.

[00:24:09] And since with humans perception is reality, that's why it's so good for us. It, it makes us feel more content, feel more happy. And then that transcends throughout the rest of our day and to making it like, it's like a rising tide lifts all ships, but like on the emotional level where it's like these happiness feelings are pushing away the depressed or the anxiety feelings. And it's just because you're, you're feeling more accomplished and more content and more joyful.

[00:24:38] There's also sort of the science of like the microbes in the soil releasing serotonin in our brains, which is yet another, you know, biology telling us we need to be gardening. But I thought that was so interesting because it was like, it's such a beautiful way to like create the environment to thrive in where it's really like, this is something that overall enhances your life just because it's, it's giving you those feelings of happiness and contentedness that are really hard to come by in other ways.

[00:25:06] It's not this like false dopamine. It's not like this checking that I did the laundry off the list. It's, it's the sort of co-creation moment. And, um, I think that that's a really, really cool part of the entire situation. The National Health Service in the UK are increasingly prescribing time in nature and community gardening as part of its green prescriptions.

[00:25:32] Scientists have found that spending two hours a week in nature is linked to better health and wellbeing. Doctors with the NHS already use social prescriptions, non-medical treatments that have health benefits to tackle things like anxiety, loneliness, and depression. This often involves referring patients to a community or volunteer organization for the social aspect.

[00:25:57] And increasingly doctors are opting for community gardening because it's not just social, but has the added benefit of time spent in nature. And it's not just the UK. Parks Prescription Canada is a national nature prescription program led by the BC Parks Foundation. They are making the intersection of health, medicine, and nature more accessible to doctors and patients by giving

[00:26:24] healthcare providers practical tools, including customized nature prescription files and patient handouts to make prescribing time outdoors just more simple and effective. Of course, all of these recommendations are based on scientific studies that have shown the universal benefits of spending time in natural environments, regardless of age group or health status.

[00:26:48] In short, gardening is good for you in more ways than just food. Speaking of food, it's a little bit about like when to harvest and the difference with ripeness and all those types of things. But the one thing that got me was the reference to the flavor gap and how, you know, there is such a difference between truck ripened, you know, fruits and vegetables versus either what we can get from our

[00:27:16] own gardens or what we can get locally from, you know, locally sourced, you know, farms or whomever. Talk a little bit about, you know, the difference between or what you've, you know, kind of discovered when you talk about things that are grown in like a depleted soil on a commercial basis versus things that are grown in, you know, a, a, a better soil or something that is grown, you know, by us in our own hands and our own gardens. Yeah.

[00:27:45] I mean, the amount of flavor that your food is able to access is going to be in direct relation to like how nutritious it can be, how dense it can be, how full, like this is going to sound so woo woo, but like how much life force energy can the food hold? Um, and so that's access to more clean water. That's, that's access to more pure soil. That's access to the right amount of sun during the right part of the year.

[00:28:13] And so that's why like a vine ripened by the natural sun tomato is going to taste better is because it's drawing in all the different minerals and all the different elements like that are accessible. Just like if someone gave you like a thousand compliments versus just two, how good would you feel about yourself? And so I think that people are really, it's hard to understand it

[00:28:37] until you've really tasted the difference, but there are just some things you cannot perfectly mimic in nature. And that's one of them. And I remember spinach is another one. Um, when I eat spinach from the grocery store, it kind of gives me this weird feeling in my mouth, almost like a coppery, like there's like a weird coating on my tongue. And when I grow spinach at home, that is not the experience at all. It's much sweeter.

[00:29:03] It's light on your palate. Um, it's in my opinion, it's an entirely different spinach experience. That is the flavor gap right there is like the, the difference in the nutrition and the taste from a homegrown tomato versus one that you just picked up from the store that was ripened in the back with gas that traveled, you know, 10,000 miles on a truck. The vegetable is never able to reach its full potential. So the flavor is never going to reach its full potential.

[00:29:29] It's funny that you said that about spinach because my husband hated spinach, absolutely refused to eat it until we started growing it ourselves. And he said the exact same thing to you. This is not, this is a completely different vegetable. This is nothing like I had ever tasted before, you know? And so yeah, he'll routinely eat fresh spinach out of our gardens, but yeah, touch it anywhere else. Yeah. It's one, it's one that I love to use as an example. Cause you can really, I could like

[00:29:53] feel the difference too, but I think most herbs as well. Like, um, I never liked chimichurri until I made it myself with my own herbs and it tasted completely different. And there are just so many things like that, but that's also the difference. Like when you do have a restaurant experience from someone that's shopping the farmer's market seasonally versus just like a in the box restaurant, you know what I mean? Like that's why sometimes these flavors are so much better is the chef really knows how to like pick what's ripe and what's at season and source it from the right

[00:30:23] place. Like that is the mark to me of someone that's like a very thoughtful chef or restaurant is like they're really able to make what's in season sing. And that's what I want to eat. And also like learn about too. I think it's so fun to go and be like, Oh wow, this is how you made delicata squash. Amazing. You know, in the gardening world too, there are, you have a way bigger selection. So one of my favorite things to grow is cheddar cauliflower. It's like an orange cauliflower

[00:30:50] and my kids, the way they devour it, they, they like cauliflower in general, but it's so buttery and like nutty and smooth. And it's just what you're getting from that essentially it's a flower, but what you're getting from that vegetable is just so different. You, I mean, you can't buy that most places either. So you just have so many more options to experience a much wider range of flavors. When you're growing from heirloom seeds and just from the garden, there's just so much that you

[00:31:20] can cultivate. I really can't. I mean, I think it's so fun to have someone taste something homegrown for the first time and just see everything like their, their brain chemistry changes. And they're like, wait, what? Like, what have I been doing with my life? It's like, yeah, I know. I know. I got it. Yep. Yeah. I know. Absolutely. As a horticulturist, when I say to people, you are what you eat. And I mean that very literally what is coming out of your soil

[00:31:46] is creating this plant. And that plant is creating your, I mean, it's, I am very literal about it. And they look at me like, huh? Oh, okay. So I had my godmother, I talk about her in the book. She's a huge inspiration for me, a fantastic gardener. Come visit me in Southern California. And she was like, Bailey, I hate to like be this person, but your water smells so strongly of chlorine that I'm like,

[00:32:12] I can't even stand it. And we had gotten so used to it. And so she was the one that, that taught me this. I put RV water filters in every single one of my beds. So then the water was getting filtered before it watered my veggies. And that's another reason why I love growing like onions, is they're so, they hold on to so much water and people are always talking about like glyphosate in the soil and like our soil health. Well, what about our water health? Not only are we,

[00:32:42] is the water either really, really toxic, like full of things that you shouldn't ingest, but then if it's over filtered, it's not being remineralized. So that's why like water in Italy is so fantastic because it has the minerals that water is supposed to have. That was another thing where I came in and was like, okay, you are what you eat and what you drink, but just anything that you're going to put into your veggies or your animals or your chickens that are laying eggs or

[00:33:07] your pigs that you raised. That's all so important. Love that message. I think we can end it right there. I love that. Anyway, yeah, but that's okay. Everybody wants to hear this. Bailey, thank you so much for, you know, talking to me and, and I, you know, I'm really going to encourage everybody, you know, grab, grab this book. You are also in the middle of recording a whole year long series with

[00:33:32] your greenhouse builder and that is super exciting. So where can everybody sort of, what's the best place for everybody to sort of find you and follow you and see, keep up with what you're doing throughout the rest of the year? Yes. Thank you so much. Baileyvantassel.com is going to be just my primary website. And then on Instagram is where you could like DM me and I'll actually respond. I'm just Baileyvantassel on Instagram. And that's where I'll, I share a lot of updates and a lot of

[00:34:00] like links and all of that stuff. So yeah, I've got like a newsletter you can sign up for so you don't miss anything, but yeah, just Baileyvantassel everywhere. And of course I will leave links to how to find Bailey, including how to get her book in the show description. And those links are also in this morning's email for those of you on the newsletter list. Bailey really is everywhere. She just participated in an online gardening summit, the great grow along this past weekend,

[00:34:29] March 1st and 2nd with the likes of Kevin Espiritu and Jacques in the garden and Jennifer McGinnis and a bunch of other people that online event is actually continuing over the next couple of weekends. I don't think Bailey has another session, but there are others coming up that are pretty interesting. I will leave a link to that in the episode description as well. And maybe they'll have a replay of Bailey's session. I will say Bailey's book to me is less like a step-by-step how-to and

[00:34:57] more like a beautiful blog put into print with eye-catching photos that explains her background and how she does things in the garden and why she does them. And not the sort of why or how the way that I explain it. Bailey is less science, more practicality with a side of anecdote. She feels her garden and wants us to

[00:35:21] feel the garden in the way that she does and have it just permeate our entire lives. I appreciate that viewpoint because it's not something that I do well. She gives advice on things like planning walking paths and the garden's location in relation to sun exposure while reminding us to stop and breathe and take it all in. I highly recommend it, both the book and stopping to breathe, honestly. That's it for me

[00:35:49] this week. I hope you enjoyed my conversation with Bailey. Spring is inching closer, thank goodness. So next week we're talking all about spring planted perennials and bulbs. Yes, we are talking veggies and flowers next week. So until next time my gardening friends, keep on cultivating that dream garden and we'll talk again soon. If you want more of my conversation with Bailey, head to patreon.com slash just grow something to hear what didn't make it into today's show.